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c/maintenancephase·posted 2 years ago by u/sena_balogun

lowest effective dose — 4 things I got wrong before I got it right

Long Term Sourced ×3 Slow Clap ×2

Genuinely asking, not being difficult.

Everyone in c/trialwatch repeats that goal weight is important. I believe it, but I have never seen anyone show why, and when I search I get 9 threads of people agreeing with each other.

Is there a paper? Is there a measurement? Or is this one of those things that is true because it has been repeated since 2023?

I am not trying to be the "source?" guy. I would just like a source.

15,042 up / 13,104 down53% upvoted36 commentsid p0sfw224 Feb 2024

36 comments

29 in this archive, depth 5

best — the order this archive was captured in

u/brigade_detector269 points·2 years ago

regain is not a moral failing

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u/neha_falk219 points·2 years ago

Did you stretch the dose interval?

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u/fabio_kuipers119 points·2 years ago

weight moves within 20kg and that is normal

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u/sarcopenia_watch39 points·2 years ago

the plateau is where the learning happens

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u/elise_ramos113 points·2 years ago

dose-stretching experiences welcome, dose-stretching instructions are not

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u/santiago_lindqvist82 points·2 years ago

regain is not a moral failing

Disagree on that part. 97.9% and 97.6% on the same vial is normal.

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u/anders_osei20 points·2 years ago

regain is not a moral failing Disagree on that part.

Yes, exactly this, and it is the bit that took me 45 weeks to accept.

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[removed]192 points·2 years ago

[removed by moderator]

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u/camila_sandvik92 points·2 years ago

the maintenance question changes at maintenance

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u/copay_card_cc-20 points·2 years ago

regain after taper is expected, plan for it

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u/still_here_2026MOD142 points·2 years ago

Retitled to remove editorialising. Put the evidence in the body.

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u/arne_ndiaye78 points·2 years ago

This is the "correlation is mechanism" thing again. You changed three variables at once.

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u/tomas_lokken53 points·2 years ago

the regain question changes at maintenance

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u/sena_balogun31 points·2 years ago

the 12.5mg dose works fine for 10 weeks of the month

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u/noor_cardoso117 points·2 years ago

The plateau is real and boring. 28 weeks at the same weight, then movement again. Patience was the intervention.

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u/brigade_detector40 points·2 years ago

the plateau is where the learning happens

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u/hassan_ostergaard19 points·2 years ago

Small correction: the trial was 21 weeks, not 20. Does not change your point but people will quote it.

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u/rasmus_petrescu16 points·2 years ago·edited

Strongly agree. Lowest effective dose is a real discovery process.

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u/ewan_marchand138 points·2 years ago

No. This is the kind of confident post that gets copied into a screenshot and repeated for years. Where is the evidence.

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u/ilias_nakamura90 points·2 years ago

state how long you have been at maintenance, week 13 is not maintenance

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u/osman_ferrari85 points·2 years ago

the lowest dose you can stay on is not the lowest dose that works

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u/sena_balogun37 points·2 years ago

Yeah, maintenance is the boring part and the important part.

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u/camila_sandvik10 points·2 years ago

weight moves within 3kg and that is normal

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u/maintenance_mode_maxmaintenance36 points·2 years ago·edited

Regain on a taper is expected. 6% back over 12 weeks, which matches the discontinuation data. Planned for it.

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u/draw_up_dizzy65 points·2 years ago

Yeah, maintenance is the boring part and the important part.

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u/liv_kuipers54 points·2 years ago

Edit to your parent would help — the concentration you quoted assumes one scenario and you have written another above it.

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u/fridge_door_no13 points·2 years ago

dose-stretching experiences welcome, dose-stretching instructions are not

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u/adnan_sandvik4 points·2 years ago·edited

the lowest dose you can stay on is not the lowest dose that works

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u/zeynep_mbeki57 points·2 years ago·edited

Yeah, maintenance is the boring part and the important part.

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About c/maintenancephase

The part nobody posts about: what happens at goal weight. Finding a lowest effective dose, dose-interval stretching, regain risk data, muscle retention, the psychology of not having a number to chase, and staying on indefinitely versus tapering.

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c/maintenancephase rules
  1. State how long you have been at maintenance. "Maintenance" at week 30 is not maintenance.
  2. Regain is not a moral failing and posts implying it is get removed.
  3. Dose-stretching experiences welcome; dose-stretching instructions are not.
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